side kicks (dynamic stretching)

backinjured · Post by **backinjured** » Oct 18, 2005 17:25

I tried to to that stretching exercise but Mr. Kurz says to kick the palm of the hand with the side of the foot. But I can't even reach my foot, my leg is really too long for this.... what am I doing wrong? I tried to lean foward too as it is explained but to reach the foot, I must learn on the side and not on the front. Please help me!!

dragon · Post by **dragon** » Oct 19, 2005 09:36

Depends which method of side raise you are doing-What is the position of the supporting leg foot?Some people keep both feet "mirrored"(kicking foot side on,support foot in exactly the same position),this would be like doing the side split.Others keep the support leg foot with the heel pointing towards the target like a side kick.This requires leaning away from the kicking leg.

Dragon.

backinjured · Post by **backinjured** » Oct 19, 2005 22:19

well I'm trying to practice Dynamic Stretching as shown in the book Stretching Scientifically and it's also explained at http://www.stadion.com/column_stretch6.html where the emphasis is on alignment, which is what I don't get at all because me, I don't know about you, but my legs are longer than my arms. And if I'm also leaning on one side, how could I clap the side of the foot raising the leg to the side???

wynnema · Post by **wynnema** » Oct 20, 2005 05:21

because you lean forward and towards the raising leg

dragon · Post by **dragon** » Oct 20, 2005 05:32

I think you're trying to combine 2 different forms of the same stretch.If you're leaning to the side you are performing the side leg raise with the body in the same position as a side kick(you won't kick your foot!).If you want to perform it the way the Stadion articles describe,try leaning forwards.

This may be hard to explain:-

Stand behind a chair and place both hands on the back.Lean forwards(even as much as having your body parallel to the floor if you wish) and raise your leg out to the side.If someone took a photo of you your body would be in the same position as a relaxed side split,only upright.

Now raise your arm straight out to the side.In order for your leg to kick the palm,the leg will need to raise slightly forwards,not directly to the side.So when the leg has raised to your maximum your foot will be in line with your chest(or there abouts),not your hip.
This takes the leg being longer than the arm out of the equation.

The higher you can kick,the more upright your body can be until you are the position of picture C in this article:-

http://www.stadion.com/column_stretch5.html

The description i've given may have the body in exaggerated positions but it will enable you to know what the stretch should feel like until you can tweak it into a position that gives you a better stretch/more comfort.

Dragon.

backinjured · Post by **backinjured** » Oct 21, 2005 18:05

I still don't really get it. I'm afraid I could still have a bad position and thus injure my hips or I don't know what.

Thanks anyway to have tried explaining me this.

However, I've found something. I was lying of the floor practicing crunches and stuff like that. Then, leg raises lying back on the floor. Moving the two legs up and down, then I thought maybe by doing circles with the legs I could work on different muscles. And I had that idea, I should turn on one side like only the left side on the floor, left leg and then move my right leg up and down. A new kind of leg raises. And after a couple of movements, I felt tired maybe because I don't usually use those muscles. Again I thought of something new, perhaps I could practice my dynamic stretching for side kicks that way?

So it leads me to these two questions:

1)Would it be a good idea to work on leg strength that way? Or isn't really useful? maybe could it lead to injuries? The movements would not be really fast, just a good speed, the same speed as normal leg raises back on the floor.

2)What about if I'd use this to increase dynamic flexibility? I'd perform the leg raises on side dynamically, increasing height and speed at the beginning of the workout. Could it lead to injuries? Is it safe? Would it be effective?

Thanks again for all your help

dragon · Post by **dragon** » Oct 22, 2005 04:40

1)-I'm afraid the lying side leg raise is nothing new,people have been doing that for years(check Arnold Schwarzeneggers Encyclopedia Of Modern Bodybuilding for example).It doesn't develop leg strength though,it's for the obliques/intercostal muscles.

2)-I suppose you could use the lying side leg raise as a dynamic flexibility exercise,however,there are 2 points that i could see being an issue.
First,dynamic flexibility exercises are preferable if they mimic the action of your main task.For example,if you're a kicker,standing stretches would be better.
Second,if you are lying with your opposite side against the floor there is no "give" in you body in case the leg movement isn't quite right.I would assume this method carries more risk of injury.

Dragon.

backinjured · Post by **backinjured** » Oct 22, 2005 09:28

Re. 1) yeah I know it's nothing new, but I've never practiced that exercise before. I didn't know though it was for obliques and intercostal. Bah it should work still a bit in the leg.

Re. 2) I'm sad to hear there are more risks of injuries. Then I'll try a method of side-kick-dynamic-stretching I'm confortable with. Perhaps buying the video of Mr. Kurz or others about kicking with no warm up. But before buying anything, maybe you could just tell me what are the main things not to do if I don't want to get injuries. I hear some many things about side kicks and hip injuries. What should I avoid?

Thanks

dragon · Post by **dragon** » Oct 22, 2005 09:34

The main things i can think of is not to perform the movement ballistically and not trying to keep your body perfectly square(you must tilt your pelvis).

The Pavel Tsatsouline material uses a different method of performing the side leg raise.It is shown in the book Beyond Stretching and the DVD Fast and Loose.

Dragon.

backinjured · Post by **backinjured** » Oct 22, 2005 10:33

I'll try to find the proper dynamic stretching.

Thanks again for all your help and comments

backinjured · Post by **backinjured** » Oct 22, 2005 21:50

by the way, I've found someone having the same problem as me in Mr. Kurz's book. Look page 135 in Stretching Scientifically ( I have the fourth edition )

CrazyBoy · Post by **CrazyBoy** » Oct 23, 2005 14:24

Hello! Dragon you said that P Tsatsouline has a different way of performing the side raises. Can you describe to me these method? I don't have those materials by him and I am curious.

dragon · Post by **dragon** » Oct 24, 2005 05:07

The Tsatsouline method of the side leg raise has the body in the same position as a side kick-The body is turned slightly away from your "target" and the heel of the supporting leg points to your "target".

Dragon.

wynnema · Post by **wynnema** » Oct 24, 2005 05:08

dragon wrote:The Tsatsouline method of the side leg raise has the body in the same position as a side kick-The body is turned slightly away from your "target" and the heel of the supporting leg points to your "target".Dragon.

Have you used this method dragon, does it improve your side/round house kicks??

dragon · Post by **dragon** » Oct 24, 2005 05:39

This is the method i use.It does take a lot of "tweaking" to get the feel of the exercise though.If done correctly it will stretch the adductors.If done incorrectly the only stretch you will feel is in the hamstring of the supporting leg.
The way i get most benefit during this stretch is to "open up" my hip when i raise the leg to the side.This is hard to explain:-instead of just concentrating on kicking the leg up to the side,imagine kicking the leg out also(as if trying to reach something with your foot that's just out of reach).

This technique did help my hip flexibility,particularly performing multiple kicks with the same leg without placing it down(front,round house or round house,reverse round house for example).

Dragon.