Question about side split

CrazyBoy · Post by **CrazyBoy** » Jun 09, 2005 13:28

Ok, thanks! But what to do if my leg training is on the same day as the isometric stretching one. Should I postpone one of it? Would one influence another? Is there the danger of injuring myself if I trained my legs and did the isometric stretches, later on the same day? I'll wait patientlly for your answer. God bless you and salut din Romania!

dragon · Post by **dragon** » Jun 10, 2005 06:51

Isometrics should be done after your strength workout(preferably sraight after,not later on in the day).Exercises such as adductor flies and pulldowns are used to prepare you for isometrics.If you are sore afterwards then you aren't ready for isometrics.
Continue with the strengthening exercises and relaxed stretches afterwards until your muscles can cope with isometrics.

Dragon

CrazyBoy · Post by **CrazyBoy** » Jun 13, 2005 04:53

Hello again Dragon (you probably are sick and tired of me and my questions, but you are the only one who bothers to answer them, 99% of the cases giving me the right advices). Probably you are an expert on stretching since you know so much. You remember my first question- the one related to the side split, where I said I couldn't touch the ground with the right inner thigh and rotate the knee so it could face forwards. Saturday, as I was doing my isometric stretching program and began performing the side split, I've managed to straighten the problems aforementioned. But how? I could only do this only by leaning my trunk to the front and touching the ground with it (lying on my chest). My question is this: why can I do those things only in that situation?

dragon · Post by **dragon** » Jun 13, 2005 05:49

I'm definately no expert and still have the same problems others do when it comes to stretching.A lot of what i know is just personal experience through trial and error.

The kurz method says you need to either point your toes up or rotate your pelvis forwards to perform the side split comfortably.It sounds that by leaning all the way forwards you are just performing the "rotate your pelvis forwards" part in a more extreme fashion.
Whether this needs to be done because of a joint/structure problem or just because it is more comfortable i can't say.
You asked about Pavel Tsatsouline in one of your earlier posts?He starts off performing the split this way(even isometrics),with the torso on the ground(he calls it roadkill splits).When you can achieve a nice flat split you can then work on being able to straighten your torso in an up right postion by resting your arms on a stool in front of you.When you can do this put the stool behind you to put your hands on to support you.
From this position you concentrate on pushing your pelvis forwards to stretch the hip flexors.
Pavel says stretching the adductors is what helps you achieve the split,stretching the hip flexors is what is needed to help you maintain an upright torso.
I cannot validate his claims with any research on whether it is an effective way of stretching,but again,from personal experience,i have found this method very helpful.

Dragon.

mat · Post by **mat** » Jun 13, 2005 07:04

As I understand it, it's supposed to be impossible to perform a full side split with feet flat on the ground (pointing forwards) while keeping your torso bolt upright. It certainly feels that way to me.

The closest you can get to this, I believe is if you have good back and hip flexibility and are able to arch your back, so that you can hold your upper body up while keeping the pelvis tilted forward.

In all the photos Thomas Kurz seems to be doing exactly this - arching his back, so it appears from the front that he is almost bolt upright.

Correct me if I am wrong?

dragon · Post by **dragon** » Jun 13, 2005 07:15

That's right.

The most desirable amount of flexibility you need in the hips/torso is enough so you can slide into the side split without your upper body falling forwards through lack of balance.

Dragon

CrazyBoy · Post by **CrazyBoy** » Jun 15, 2005 05:21

Ok, that's a lot of information! From what I can understand, eventhough you know (and can do) about flexibility, you still have some problems with your programs. So, it's not a big problem if I perform the side split in this manner, but as I've said this is the only solution to my "toes pointing forward" issue. I have a question: in my isometric stretching program, I perform the specific warm-up, then the front splits and afterwards the side split. But when I perform the side split, I do not execute it enterely, but gradually- the first try is a 3-4 inches away from the ground and the second one is fully on the ground. Is this ok? Please respond and advice me! Thank you and salut from Romania!

dragon · Post by **dragon** » Jun 15, 2005 05:32

Yes,i think a lot of people go easier on the first set,treating it almost like a warm up set.

Dragon

CrazyBoy · Post by **CrazyBoy** » Jun 20, 2005 06:28

Ok, I am back and with a new question

! My question is regarding the intensity of the dynamic stretches. Mr Kurz says that you should sweat a lot when one does the dynamic stretches (in contrast with the isometrics), but I am not. Au contraire, I sweat more when I do the isometrics. Can you tell me why?
Oh, whenever I do the front leg raises, at my final set (4 of 10 reps) my right leg is in straight line, but my left leg is hard to raise up my shoulder level. Is this because I can do the righ front split and I can't the left front split?
I'll be waiting for your response! Salut from Romania.

dragon · Post by **dragon** » Jun 20, 2005 06:37

You should sweat a lot during dynamic stretches?Never heard that before.
I sweat more during isometrics too.The intensity used during isometrics is far greater for me than the intensity of leg raises.
Remember,you should do no more leg raises than is required.When you reach your maximum level of flexibility/velocity you should stop as fatigue can cause a drop in your performance.

As for the height difference-yes,i would say the difference will probably present itself in other forms of flexibility.I think most people will display a slight difference from one side to the other.

Dragon

CrazyBoy · Post by **CrazyBoy** » Jun 21, 2005 13:47

So, sweating while doing isometrics it's not a problem. Ok, but I was meaning to ask this: I know it's forbidden/counterproductive to do dynamic movements after isometrics (passive or relaxed) stretches, but is it ok, after a dynamic movement to do isometrics?
Let's say that my training starts with dynamic stretches and ends with a serie of roundhouse kicks. Is it safe to perform the splits after the roundhouse kicks?
I will wait for your answer. God bless you and salut from Romania!

Post by **Thomas Kurz** » Jun 21, 2005 17:20

CrazyBoy wrote:Mr Kurz says that you should sweat a lot when one does the dynamic stretches (in contrast with the isometrics), but I am not. Au contraire, I sweat more when I do the isometrics. Can you tell me why?

I do not recall saying or writing such a thing. Could you point me to the source of this info (book or article, and which page)?

Post by **Thomas Kurz** » Jun 21, 2005 17:25

CrazyBoy wrote:I know it's forbidden/counterproductive to do dynamic movements after isometrics (passive or relaxed) stretches, but is it ok, after a dynamic movement to do isometrics?

Counterproductive, yes. But forbidden? Who forbade doing so?

CrazyBoy wrote:Let's say that my training starts with dynamic stretches and ends with a serie of roundhouse kicks. Is it safe to perform the splits after the roundhouse kicks?

Yes.

CrazyBoy · Post by **CrazyBoy** » Jun 22, 2005 09:13

Thank you for replying Mr Kurz. First of all, please excuse my mistakes present in my post. i don't have the article next to me, but I can surely remember that you said that one, during dynamic stretches, sweat diferently than during isometrics. This I know I've read it. The term "forbidden" I used just because it popped in my head (I couldn't think at anyelse word). So, it's not a problem. I have a request: can you tell me what are the connective tissues and their role? Please. God bless you and salut from Romania.

Failure is the foundation of success. -Kancho Ashihara

Post by **Thomas Kurz** » Jun 22, 2005 09:56

CrazyBoy wrote:I can surely remember that you said that one, during dynamic stretches, sweat diferently than during isometrics. This I know I've read it.

Wrong. Quote right or not at all.

CrazyBoy wrote:I have a request: can you tell me what are the connective tissues and their role? Please. God bless you and salut from Romania.

Most dictionaries give definitions of the connective tissue in general and of the fibrous connective tissue too. Biology (specifically, fundamentals of cytology and histology) is the first academic subject (1st year, 1st semester) taught to p.e. teachers and instructors so your instructor must know these definitions.